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Master Instigator removing caches???
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Jimbo 2



Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Posts: 163
Location: Manitoba

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 2:28 am    Post subject: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

It looks like he is archiving his caches.



 



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Dragonfreys



Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 364
Location: Manitoba-Westman

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 3:34 am    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

What/who is provoking hiders into mass removal of caches?!? MI's caches are amongst the best in the province, and take a bit of planning to get to. We have enjoyed the adventures so far and were looking forward to going for the ones further a field as our team grows to be more mobile (i.e. our son starts to leave us in the dust). Is there an inevitable souring to the activity as people get it out of their system? This seeming trend is very disturbing, surely there is enough real estate in Manitoba that everyone can get along?





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Jimbo 2



Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Posts: 163
Location: Manitoba

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 4:32 am    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

It does seem kinda strange....I have actually done one of his caches, and there wasn't anything wrong with it.



There seems to be a lot of debate as of late, about cache quality. Some people don't like micros, some don't like puzzle caches, etc. This shouldn't be a problem though because the cache listings indicate the size/type of cache, as well as who placed it.



If you don't like micros, don't look for them! If you decide to look for them, don't complain about them.



Although micros aren't my favorite, I still look for them if I'm going to be in the area. I've never posted a negative comment about any cache I've found, I'm just happy people are putting them out there.



A couple of my caches have netted the odd negative comment-FTF too cheap looking, didn't like area cache was in....I'm not going to let that deter me though.



I hope this archiving and removing caches isn't becoming a trend.....



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junglehair



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 374
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 5:35 am    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

Oh man, I really hate to see that happen.  M.I. has some really great caches out there and I have fond memories from most of the ones I found.  Wacko Willy's Wicked Hoard was my 800th find and I thought it was so clever I created a similar cache to that in New York.  In fact, when I moved away from there, that cache was the first one someone wanted to adopt.  My mom and I got covered in Woodticks when going for Last of the Manitoba Ents, but it was all worth it for a look at that giant tree.  I love big old trees like that and as such, it's still one of my favourite caches around here.  Even Go Fly A Kite, which was muggled and archived a while ago now, has great memories associated with it.  One of the first times I took geo_kitten out caching we did that cache.  Her and her older brother had a great time flying the kites afterwards.  We need more caches like that, not less!

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FoodNinja



Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 109
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 10:37 am    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

this isnt cool man,,,, lets just keep out thoughts to ourselves as finders, with out hiders we would be with out sport.



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JayPeg



Joined: 02 Jun 2006
Posts: 131
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 3:14 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

This is a trend that is not hurting the person with the big gob, it affects those starting cacheing and those the enjoy the hobby. M.I.s caches are the kind that I would introduce to a new cacher and explain that this is why caching is fun.

I personally don't have that many caches out there and those I do have are simple. For every 1 complaint I have at least 20 that enjoyed the find. With hiders like M.I., they inspire and get the creative juices flowing for some new caches. I have a few planned for the near future that I would consider creative and original. If someone does not like them...TOO BAD!!

Remember people, this is a hobby and nobody is getting paid to hide or find caches. Without Hiders there won't be any finds!!!!

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Kabuthunk



Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 262
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 4:10 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

Yeah, this threw me off as well. I was just poking around previous finds, seeing who found 'em after me, and noticed 'micro park cache' was disabled.

What the heck... I thought it was a nice cache. Same with 'I am the walrus'... I loved the placement of that one. And it was an excellent hike to get there. Definitely caches I'd use to introduce new people to geocaching with.


Although, given his "disabling" message, I'm not sure what he's complaining about. Looking at the 'newest in Manitoba', most are either set to "small" size or "regular" size.
Heck... 95% of any recent micros are either Skaven's 'conquista del mundo' series, and the 'mayor of winnipeg' series... which are just that... series-caches. Thusly, they're micros for a reason (sorta).

I can understand not liking micros. Looking for a micro in a forest *coughmayorofwinnipegstbonifacecough* doesn't exactly fill me with joy, but some people like micros, and I knew what I was getting into when I went in search of it (well... except for the 'massive pile of branches' aspect). And I'll continue to go for these micros when I'm up for a hunt (the fact that it was cold and dark didn't help my search of that aformentioned cache :P ). If it's still there in spring (assuming it isn't winter friendly), I'll go after it again... because I like caches in a forest in general. Or I'll go after it once it's found again.


So yeah... not sure why he's archiving all of his. It's too bad... there were a number of his that I had my eye on to go after when I had more time :{

Definitely not a cool trend to be seeing.

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MHz



Joined: 20 Apr 2005
Posts: 281
Location: Morris

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 5:50 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

Some of MI's caches are my most memorable as well. We slogged down 14km of ATV trails through the mud, mosquitoes and then rain with Brains, Brawn and Beauty and didn't even finish the multi! First and only time I've been to Nopiming prov. Park. I was really annoyed that day as being totally soaked and covered in mud and mosquito bites but would I slog through the elements to solve puzzles like that again? You bet! In a heart beat! I will never forget that day! Too bad Nopiming is just too far away for me to get time to visit it more.

I beleive I've done all of MI's caches except for Go Fly a Kite and Jukebox as both were muggled before I could get to them. I've never ever been disappointed with any of his caches.

First PBD then MI! I really don't like this trend! It's been a very sad couple of month.



MHz

-- Edited by MHz at 11:51, 2006-11-30

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polarbeardiggers



Joined: 22 Mar 2005
Posts: 52
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 5:53 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

     "I am in the process of removing all of my cache containers. It is apparent that original interesting caches are frowned upon so I am clearing space for more ( bleeping ) micro's."this is the quote on every cache listing owned by MI,newly archived, MI,a long standing cacher in the manitoba community,very adventurous, and creative cacher in his own right,multi's that some could never complete,scattered throughout the town and country,his caches,you knew had the quality of heavy thinking,this man started the MBGA with help and support from manitoba cachers alike,does this sound like a person that would get bent out of shape over one persons opinion,or could this be the same attack by the same group of people that persuaded me to give up on all hopes of enjoying such a great fun outdoor game.behind the doors of scheming,running down cache hides,like they had control over geocaching.com.I  have had great competitive battles with MI,over the last two years,and had the pleasure of caching with him,a very honest and creative thinker,one who has helped me stay in the game,and convinced me not to take a negative remark to heart,wether or not the person represents a group of cachers.I have adopted a new policy,but taken it to a newly extreme level,but a year ago a group of three cachers just newly started,adopted a new policy for logging any of their new caches,that any negative feed back would be deleted,I was very troubled by this,especially from new cachers, where did they encounter such troubled feed back from before to openly list their caches with such a harsh comment,my new policy will not be openly made but the results will be more severe,as a hider who has spent alot of money and time placing caches for the open public to enjoy has no room or patience for grumpy crass cache logs.I personally aplaud MI's stand,and we all will miss his contributions he has made to the manitoba caching community,perhaps time will heal his wounds too,MERRY CHRISTMAS TO THE MI FAMILY,yours truely,the POLARBEARDIGGERS.

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MHz



Joined: 20 Apr 2005
Posts: 281
Location: Morris

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 8:12 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

MI's alter ego gumpy has deleted all of their cache finds.

There really is something seriously wrong here but I'm at a complete loss to understand what it is.

I've had trouble in the past where I thought keeping one of my caches just wasn't worth the effort but I never thought of yanking it. The furthest thought I got to was replacing it so it's a typical traditional cache. (Boy, I've had those thoughts many times in the past year about that cache). I've had a few nasty negative private e-mails about it from various cachers but the Geo-Kitchen Cache still exists. I tell myself it's unique and the majority of the cachers who find it enjoy it for it's uniqueness.

I think this is another one of those instances where I need to be hit over the head to understand what's going on!

MHz

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Kabuthunk



Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 262
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 8:36 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

Deleting all their finds too?!?  Man, what the heck???  I mean... wanting to leave the hobby is one thing... but actually taking the effort to go back and erase any history that you've ever been here is another.  What, the mafia leaning on him or something?

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junglehair



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 374
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 8:49 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

MHz wrote:




I've had trouble in the past where I thought keeping one of my caches just wasn't worth the effort but I never thought of yanking it. The furthest thought I got to was replacing it so it's a typical traditional cache.







If you do that, people who had to find it the hard way will complain that you've made it too easy now for the rest of them.  You just can't win.



I think people just like to complain sometimes.  The key is to not take it personally.  We all have caches that we like and we all have caches that we dislike.  I can honestly say that of the 1800+ finds I have, there is only one that I can think of that I felt needed to be removed, or at least have the description changed to have it make sense.  It was a hide in Rochester, where the owner tried to make very difficult, but really all he did was make it so vague that it was impossible to tell what you needed to do.



I can relate to Kabuthunk's frustration at Mayor of Winnipeg - St. Boniface since I spent a great deal of time looking for that micro in the woods.  That doesn't mean I think he should pull that cache though.  I actually very much enjoyed going after the Mayor of Winnipeg series of caches.



I also don't believe that the MBGA is out there trying to be the cache police as PBD is implying.  If individual members of the Executive are making comments, it's based on their personal beliefs, not with the support of the MBGA. 



They are, however, trying to educate people on how to place quality caches.  For example, why put a micro where an ammo can could easily go?  Or that used peanut butter jars can attract wildlife muggles, so it's better to use a container that has never been used to store food.



 



 



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junglehair



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 374
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 9:03 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

polarbeardiggers wrote:




as a hider who has spent alot of money and time placing caches for the open public to enjoy has no room or patience for grumpy crass cache logs.






I find this interesting PBD since I actually took offence to some of the logs you posted on the caches my mom and I placed up near Gimli.  For example, when you referred to our cache "What's the Point" as "What's the Point of Looking".  I never considered deleting your log though.  I just chalked it up to having a different sense of humour than I. 



Perhaps we all need to consider when we are writing our logs, how it might sound to the person who, as PBD said, has spent a lot of time and money to place that cache there.  As has been mentioned several times already - without the hiders, there would be nothing for us to find.



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Kabuthunk



Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 262
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 9:03 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

I think what we need is a giant "how to place caches" kinda learning session, or at least page on the board.  I'm sure I myself would learn a lot from it, as would others (see my most recent rant... other topic).



Definitely, the micro-in-forest can be frustrating, but definitely shouldn't be removed for it.  People will rant about it.  I know I did.  But people will rant about anything.  If they've had a hard day... they'll need to find the smallest detail to yell about, just so they can vent.  It's human nature (I think).  Because one person's mad doesn't mean you should remove the fun from everyone else.



 



Note: I'd like to take this opportunity to apologize if anyone's been offended or irritated with my recent rants.  Lotsa personal stuff going on... nerves have been getting a little frazzled lately.  If anyone would like me to either modify anything I've written anywhere, or apologize at any point, please don't hesitate to ask, I would be glad to oblige.



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junglehair



Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 374
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Nov 30, 2006 9:14 pm    Post subject: RE: Master Instigator removing caches??? Reply with quote

Kabuthunk wrote:






I think what we need is a giant "how to place caches" kinda learning session, or at least page on the board.  I'm sure I myself would learn a lot from it, as would others (see my most recent rant... other topic).








Check out the Geocacher University site: http://www.geocacher-u.com/  It has some great information for hiding and finding caches.  I agree it would be nice to compile a list here of the do's and don'ts for hiding a cache.



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