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wauchope



Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 18

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 4:04 pm    Post subject: Just so you know Reply with quote

I am not that software savy but if I can do it almost anyone can.

Everytime you Send E-Mail to a User through Geocaching.com your email address is not private to whomever recieves it even if you uncheck the radio box that says they'll keep it private.

this is from the Geocaching.com privacy statement

"We respect the privacy of our users. As a result, we allow you the ability to email other accounts through online forms without exposing your email address"

Pure bunk and a big fat fairy tale.

I know the private address of each and every person who sends me an email through geocaching.com whether they want me to know it or not.

I'll let you figure out how and its real easy,up to you if you uncheck that radio button ,but it doesn't work.

now I'm not sure what you can do about it ,maybe someone here knows how to keep your address private?
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candaceandwill



Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 164

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I look after a couple of GC.com accounts and thought I'd test it out...

Had one account send another account a message, making sure to un-select the "Send your email address" option.

Here is what I received... and apparently I'm not having the same problem you are.

Quote:
from Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>
to (my receiving accounts email address was here)

date Tue, May 4, 2010 at 1:02 PM
subject [GEO] candaceandwill contacting crestviewcubs from Geocaching.com
mailed-bygeocaching.com

hide details 1:02 PM (0 minutes ago)


Test

User's Profile:
http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=e265610b-f149-4474-8fe8-3f23735015e4

------------------------------------------------------------
This email was sent without a return email address. You will need to respond to this email through the Geocaching Web site. Visit http://www.geocaching.com/email/?guid=e265610b-f149-4474-8fe8-3f23735015e4 and log in to respond to the message.

Forward abuse complaints to: contact@geocaching.com

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1purplemonkeydishwasher1



Joined: 15 Mar 2009
Posts: 42
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This made me curious. Went back into old emails. I could not find the address for everyone's messages. Somedid show their emails, other did not. Unless this is a newer thing happening. I will do some tests with my girlfriends account tonight and see what happens.
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ertyu



Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also do not encounter this issue.

I would suggest that if you actually find a bug such as this that you report it to groundspeak instead of publicizing it further.
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wauchope



Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 18

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok

open an e-mail message and and click on the file menu
then click on properties
then click on details
and there you have it all the source e-mails for you to see.

easier to read if you then click on 'message source'

this is not an error on geocaching.com it is for each and every e-mail you send and recieve just thought you outta know.


what does it matter that I've just posted how ? any one with evil purposes will know this anyway

on another topic
This in particular really bugs me how people so carelessly handle thier e-mail addresses. Everyday I get forwarded e-mails that have addresses of people I don't know but my friends do ,some of them I have been able to educate and at least send e-mails using the Bcc: address bar when sending to mulitple addresses.
when I check my trash barrel I always see e-mails from myself and wonder how did I send an e-mail to myself promoting Russian girls looking for husbands!!! I spoke to my interent provider and they tell me that they have no way of stoping this type of spam.But at least now they put it into a trash barrel that I can later check if I wanted to.
and yes I am guilty of using my e-mail carlessly but I cant stop my friends from forwarding my addresses and thats how all this spam got started.
The internet is paying the price as millions upon millions of spam e-mails are floating around which is slowly the system down compared to what it was 5 years ago.
well I rambled on sorry

GET a damn good virus checker and keep it updated.
Its cheap insurance for computer safety
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ertyu



Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wauchope wrote:
ok

open an e-mail message and and click on the file menu
then click on properties
then click on details
and there you have it all the source e-mails for you to see.

easier to read if you then click on 'message source'

this is not an error on geocaching.com it is for each and every e-mail you send and recieve just thought you outta know.

...


Again I reiterate that I have reviewed the entire mail message and I see no information leak whatsoever when you uncheck the 'I want to send my email address along with this message.' The sender's email address is not included, available or discoverable from the message in any way I can determine.

Obviously if you send a regular email message, information about who sent it is included in the message, that is how it is designed to work.

But I'm now confused. You just said "this is not an error on geocaching.com" but previously said that any message sent from geocaching.com includes your email address even if you tell it not to. If the message included the email address contrary to what the message form said, I would certainly consider that an error. I'm lost as to what problem you are actually concerned about?
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wauchope



Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 18

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

take any e-mail you have recieved and follow my steps you just highlighted
it takes some searching but its there.
never said it was an error just that they claim to make your e-mail private which it is not.
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ertyu



Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wauchope wrote:
take any e-mail you have recieved and follow my steps you just highlighted
it takes some searching but its there.
never said it was an error just that they claim to make your e-mail private which it is not.


I continue with my assertion that you are incorrect. The email address is not included if you uncheck the box as appropriate.
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ertyu



Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

However, if by some chance what you are saying is happening in some cases, it is most certainly a bug and needs to be addressed by groundspeak.
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wauchope



Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 18

PostPosted: May 04, 2010 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

its not a bug

I don't really care if you think so or not as apparenly you seem to making ever effort to assure people here it is a bug.

pasted from an e-mail message source all I have done here is blank out the private e-mails addresses with XXXX which are my own and the senders

in RED is the senders private e-mail address

" Return-path: <noreply@geocaching.com>
Received: from bgmpimr3.sasknet.sk.ca ([192.168.234.30])
by cgmail2.sasknet.sk.ca (SaskTel eMessaging Service)
with ESMTP id <0L1U00LJ3RB22E50@cgmail2.sasknet.sk.ca> for
xxxxxxxx; Mon, 03 May 2010 10:33:03 -0600 (CST)
Received: from sasknet.sk.ca ([142.165.20.180]) by bgmpimr3.sasknet.sk.ca
(SaskTel eMessaging Service)
with ESMTP id <0L1U005ENRB28EW0@bgmpimr3.sasknet.sk.ca> for
xxxxxxx@xxxxxxx (ORCPT xxxxxx); Mon,
03 May 2010 10:33:02 -0600 (CST)
Received: from neutron (neutron [127.0.0.1]) by pps.custmail (8.14.1/8.14.1)
with SMTP id o43GT9Ek006976 for <xxxxxxx>; Mon,
03 May 2010 10:33:02 -0600
Received: from psmtp.com (na1sys020amx008.postini.com [64.18.10.48])
by neutron.sasknet.sk.ca with ESMTP id nj1d2t465-1
(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT)
for <xxxxx>; Mon, 03 May 2010 10:33:02 -0600
Received: from source ([69.27.125.8]) (using TLSv1)
by na1sys020amx008.postini.com ([64.18.9.10]) with SMTP; Mon,
03 May 2010 16:33:01 +0000 (GMT)
Received: from bx258.blacksun.ca (localhost [127.0.0.1])
by bx258.blacksun.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id o43GX0ao001480 for
<xxxxxxx>; Mon, 03 May 2010 10:33:00 -0600
Received: (from wauchope@localhost) by bx258.blacksun.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit)
id o43GX0qR001478 for xxxxxxx; Mon, 03 May 2010 10:33:00 -0600
Received: from signal.groundspeak.com (signal.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.157])
by bx258.blacksun.ca (8.13.1/8.13.1) with SMTP id o43GWoJ7001425 for
<wauchopeXXXXXXX>; Mon, 03 May 2010 10:32:50 -0600
Received: from web07 (web07.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.167])
by signal.groundspeak.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14A6C4A0D96 for
<wauchopeXXXXXXX>; Mon, 03 May 2010 09:32:49 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Mon, 03 May 2010 09:32:49 -0700
From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>
Subject: [GEO] b&ladventures contacting wauchope from Geocaching.com
X-Originating-IP: [64.110.222.83]

To: wauchope@XXXXXXXX
Reply-to: XXXXXXX@sasktel.net

Message-id: <20100503163249.14A6C4A0D96@signal.groundspeak.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by bx258.blacksun.ca id
o43GWoJ7001425
X-Mailer: Groundspeak Mailer
Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on bx258.blacksun.ca
X-yoursite-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean
X-yoursite-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information
X-yoursite-MailScanner-From: noreply@geocaching.com
X-pstn-levels: (S: 0.85813/99.86809 CV:99.9000 FC:95.5390 LC:95.5390 R:95.9108
P:95.9108 M:97.0282 C:98.6951 )
X-pstn-settings: 2 (0.5000:0.5000) s cv gt3 gt2 gt1
X-pstn-addresses: from <noreply@geocaching.com> [594/25]
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure
engine=1.12.8161:2.4.5,1.2.40,4.0.166
definitions=2010-05-03_08:2010-02-06,2010-05-03,2010-05-03 signatures=0
X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=cust_notspam policy=default score=0 spamscore=0
ipscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=3 classifier=spam adjust=0
reason=mlx engine=5.0.0-0908210000 definitions=main-1005030081
Original-recipient: rfc822;XXXXXXXXX@sasktel.net
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.4 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_111,
RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,SPF_PASS autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5
X-Spam-Level:



------------------------------------------------------------
Forward abuse complaints to: contact@geocaching.com
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angelcastaneda



Joined: 04 Jan 2010
Posts: 47

PostPosted: May 05, 2010 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

signaldrama

I think this is what's going on:

If you check "I want to send my email address along with this message.", then the mail header uses your email address as the reply-to: value. This, I believe, is done for two reasons:

    - Geocaching.com cannot send an email as, say, your.name@gmail.com, as you have not provided them with your credentials.
    - When the recipient hits reply, the To: field gets auto populated with the cleverly named reply-to address.


Exhibit A:
Code:

Delivered-To: contact@angelcastaneda.com
Received: by 10.216.45.143 with SMTP id p15cs266060web;
        Wed, 21 Apr 2010 07:51:30 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.115.98.17 with SMTP id a17mr1741655wam.74.1271861488570;
        Wed, 21 Apr 2010 07:51:28 -0700 (PDT)
Return-Path: <noreply@geocaching.com>
Received: from signal.groundspeak.com (signal.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.157])
        by mx.google.com with ESMTP id 26si14755674pzk.10.2010.04.21.07.51.28;
        Wed, 21 Apr 2010 07:51:28 -0700 (PDT)
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of noreply@geocaching.com designates 66.150.167.157 as permitted sender) client-ip=66.150.167.157;
Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of noreply@geocaching.com designates 66.150.167.157 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=noreply@geocaching.com
Received: from web06 (web06.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.132])
   by signal.groundspeak.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4E4C4A01AA
   for <contact@angelcastaneda.com>; Wed, 21 Apr 2010 07:51:27 -0700 (PDT)
X-Originating-IP: [24.77.130.94]
X-Mailer: Groundspeak Mailer
MIME-Version: 1.0
From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>
To: contact@angelcastaneda.com
Reply-To: xxxxxxx@shaw.ca         <---------- NOTICE REPLY-TO IS POPULATED
Date: 21 Apr 2010 07:51:27 -0700
Subject: [GEO] Pa_Bottle contacting angelcastaneda from Geocaching.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <20100421145127.B4E4C4A01AA@signal.groundspeak.com>


If you don't check "I want to send my email address along with this message.", there is no reply-to value filled out.

Exhibit B:
Code:

Delivered-To: contact@angelcastaneda.com
Received: by 10.216.45.143 with SMTP id p15cs90785web;
        Fri, 30 Apr 2010 12:51:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.114.164.20 with SMTP id m20mr4937657wae.7.1272657109783;
        Fri, 30 Apr 2010 12:51:49 -0700 (PDT)
Return-Path: <noreply@geocaching.com>
Received: from signal.groundspeak.com (signal.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.157])
        by mx.google.com with ESMTP id c24si5168538wam.34.2010.04.30.12.51.49;
        Fri, 30 Apr 2010 12:51:49 -0700 (PDT)
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of noreply@geocaching.com designates 66.150.167.157 as permitted sender) client-ip=66.150.167.157;
Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of noreply@geocaching.com designates 66.150.167.157 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=noreply@geocaching.com
Received: from web05 (web05.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.131])
   by signal.groundspeak.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA34E7880C9
   for <contact@angelcastaneda.com>; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 12:51:48 -0700 (PDT)
X-Originating-IP: [205.200.9.116]
X-Mailer: Groundspeak Mailer
MIME-Version: 1.0
From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>
To: contact@angelcastaneda.com   <------- NO REPLY-TO VALUE IS SENT
Date: 30 Apr 2010 12:51:48 -0700
Subject: [GEO] Jets96 contacting angelcastaneda from Geocaching.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <20100430195148.DA34E7880C9@signal.groundspeak.com>
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candaceandwill



Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 164

PostPosted: May 05, 2010 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wauchope,

PM sent.

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ertyu



Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 05, 2010 3:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wauchope wrote:
its not a bug

I don't really care if you think so or not as apparenly you seem to making ever effort to assure people here it is a bug.

pasted from an e-mail message source all I have done here is blank out the private e-mails addresses with XXXX which are my own and the senders

in RED is the senders private e-mail address
...


Thanks for the example as it helps clear things up. I believe you are misunderstanding what has happened. In the example you provided I believe the sender has chosen not to make their email address private and thus it is included in the message. As angelcastaneda described there are two different results depending on if you check or uncheck the box.

If however, the sender did choose to hide their email address and it still was included, I would consider that a serious bug and thats what I understood as what you were initially describing.

I do not believe there is any issue with the geocaching.com website or privacy policy.
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1Queenand4Jokers



Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 270
Location: Manitoba

PostPosted: May 06, 2010 10:01 pm    Post subject: Enjoying the discussion Reply with quote

Everytime I email I expect someone to track me down somehow since in this game everyone seems to be a genius! I actually do geocaching hoping it rubs off on me and some of it (fingers crossed) actually has since I never bothered trying to solve puzzles like I do now. Such a feeling of accomplishment.

A crazy thing just happened so some acquaintances of mine from my hometown. Someone replicated their Facebook profiles and then signed up all their friends again saying their account had been compromised. They stole all major info including pics etc. Then the hacker/stalkers went and started having deep conversations with the newly signed up friends and also signing up for porn sites etc... The false profiles were shut down when the original people let messages on the Wall saying legal action would be taken. Just last week.

We just have to believe that we don't have CRAZY geocachers out there who want to destroy our caches and our lives.
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lizardo



Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 497
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: May 07, 2010 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have tested this out and I noticed a situation where one may perceive that their e-mail addy is being sent when the "send my e-mail address" option is not selected.

I sent a message from mine to my wife's account with the following settings:

Send My E-mail Address: NO
Send me a copy of this e-mail: YES

When I rec'd my copy of my own message here is the header (edited for relevance):
Code:

.......
Received: from WEB08 (web08.groundspeak.com [66.150.167.171]) by
 signal.groundspeak.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85A464A105C for
 <geo.lizardo@gmail.com>; Thu,  6 May 2010 18:52:54 -0700 (PDT)
X-Originating-IP: [24.79.237.61]
X-Mailer: Groundspeak Mailer
MIME-Version: 1.0
From: Geocaching <noreply@geocaching.com>
To: geo.lizardo@gmail.com
Date: 6 May 2010 18:52:54 -0700
Subject: [GEO] Copy of email <[GEO] Lizardo contacting Tannasaurus from
 Geocaching.com> to Tannasaurus
..........

The "To:" reference is obvious, but 5 lines above there is the ESMTP reference to my "private" address. Although when I look at the header of the e-mail that arrived in my wife's inbox, there is no reference to the sender's (my) e-mail.

But you did mention that you are able to see the addresses in e-mails that have been sent to you from other users. Just to offer my two cents on that one, I always offer my e-mail address to whomever I send a contact message to. My geocaching e-mail is not my primary account, so I don't really care who gets it. Is it possible that the people who have contacted you are fine with you receiving their e-mail address? I hope that is the case. But if not, Groundspeak should definitely be made aware.

Thanks for encouraging people to keep an updated malware system in place. Always good advice. And too few people follow it. Mind you, I'm kind of on the fence on that one, as "user misadventure" is the kind of thing that keeps people like me employed! Smile

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